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Old 12-30-2015, 02:35 AM   #31
Theo Raeken
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Also worth pointing out that the only reason Rey holds her own in the fight with Kylo Ren is that by that point he's already received a serious crossbow bolt injury to the side which he's still bleeding out from and has been burned by the lightsaber in his duel with Finn just moments before. Having just seen Kylo kill her father figure and potentially kill her only friend in Finn, Rey had enough rage on her side to turn the battle in her favor the exact same way Luke had when the Emperor suggested that they turn Leia to the dark side or Anakin did... pretty much any time he fought anyone because he was a whiny baby who gave into rage too easily.

As for being an expert marksman the first time she's ever used a gun, I'm pretty sure she tells Han that she "knows how to use it", meaning she's more than likely used a blaster before? I'm not 100% on this but there's nothing that really suggests it's the first time she's used a blaster other than forgetting to turn the safety off and even then that could just be down to the weapon being different and general fear rather than her own inexperience?

Also the point about speaking droid is a little moot considering 99% of characters in Star Wars seem to speak droid. Just because we don't see her having a history with droids doesn't mean she doesn't have one?

Honestly I think she's no more "perfect" than Anakin or Luke was in their first movie. Don't forget we have a whole trilogy - there will be more layers to Rey uncovered in the next two films for certain.

I'm sorta with you on Kylo Ren being a bad actor though. He definitely wasn't the strongest, that was for sure.







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Old 12-30-2015, 02:45 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Kenobi View Post
As for being an expert marksman the first time she's ever used a gun, I'm pretty sure she tells Han that she "knows how to use it", meaning she's more than likely used a blaster before? I'm not 100% on this but there's nothing that really suggests it's the first time she's used a blaster other than forgetting to turn the safety off and even then that could just be down to the weapon being different and general fear rather than her own inexperience?
Just to add to this that the original trilogy and the prequel trilogy both showed instances of those who were exceptionally strong with the Force having innate skills with things such as weapons precision and dexterity. Even if it WAS the first time she picked up a gun (which, as Tommy said, there's no reason for us to assume was the case), the fact that she has such a strong connection with the Force would be enough for her to have exceptional aim. Once she learned how to pull the trigger (and turn the safety off, of course), all she would have had to do was go with her instincts.







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Old 12-30-2015, 02:48 AM   #33
Theo Raeken
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To be honest I'm still really fucking confused how Luke's shot in Episode IV managed to change direction at the last second to hit the Death Star's weak spot. SOMEBODY PLEASE TELL ME THERE'S AN ACTUAL EXPLANATION FOR THAT.







because there's always time for second guesses, I don't wanna know

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Old 12-30-2015, 03:00 AM   #34
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Um... he used the Force? Maybe? XDDD No, I honestly have no idea.

I would like to add, re: Kylo's portrayal. Does no one remember how subpar most of the acting was in EVERY PREVIOUS STAR WARS MOVIE? I mean, the movies were almost notorious for having less than amazing actors. I'm not saying that I think Adam was awesome, but saying he "wasn't the strongest actor" in the first Star Wars movie to actually feature solid acting in some of the main roles is just funny to me. I love the original trilogy as much as anyone who was raised on it, but I'm also perfectly willing to recognize its flaws and love it unconditionally anyway.







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Old 12-30-2015, 03:07 AM   #35
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For the record, Adam's acting is a million times better than Hayden's was. There's nowhere to go but up from those prequels. There was so much talent in tfa though.







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Old 12-30-2015, 06:49 AM   #36
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Tbh if we think back to Phantom Menace, Anakin was also very 'flawless' as a character. He was a good pilot, shooter (in the cruiser), strong connection with the Force (his Midi-chlorian count), only human who can pod race, building droids.... He excelled at everything he attempted and he was even younger than Rey in this film. She nearly crashed the Millennium Falcon when she tried to take off the first time. She does have internal struggle at least equal to Anakin and Luke, because of the way her family left her behind. If anything Anakin's angst was far more manufactured and ridiculous than Rey's. We don't actually know that much about her history to know her skill set. Her emotions were on her side in the battle with Kylo, and he almost bested her before that so clearly she's not as experienced with a light saber. She has plenty of ways to learn and grow throughout the movies. I honestly hate when female leads are picked apart for being perfect while their male counterparts are not, even though it's literally the same thing. Imo thank god we have a female protagonist and female Jedi in the series.

Kylo's acting was just as bad as some of the originals to me too. I'm not that impressed with either villains though, and rebuilding the Death Star *again* was so disappointing. I'm hoping the villains get more fleshed out later on the series. No one will ever measure up to Darth and the Emperor so I'm keeping my expectations in check.

I think it was showing respect for the source material with all the nods to the old films too. Sometimes they were too blatant imo but the sentiment was nice.

There will always be a way to find fault if you look hard enough. TFA wasn't perfect but it was a really entertaining film and addition to the Star Wars universe







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Old 12-30-2015, 01:07 PM   #37
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Please don't try to invalidate the opinions of people who disagree with you by claiming sexism. You should know that I of all people am not going to do that. If anything I overvalue female characters in film. Look at my hero worship of Ilsa Faust. She's the best damn spy in the verse and you don't see me complaining that she's overpowered and Ethan Hunt isn't. I just think that in this case, it's terribly handled.

I'm not gonna get into defending the prequels because they were shit, although I seem to have enjoyed them more than TFA. But look at the original trio - Luke, Leia and Han. That trio each had major flaws and each had their own strong skill. What exactly can Poe or Finn do that Rey can't? She makes them superfluous. That makes the film out of balance. I can tell you all about the flaws of Luke, Leia, Han, Finn and even Poe. What's Rey's flaw?

Plus, looking back at Luke, he was very flawed. That's what made him interesting. If he was just perfect, I would've hated the guy.

Edit: I thought that Kylo Ren's injury was going to slow him down, but I saw no sign that it actually did. When he fought he showed no sign of carrying an injury, despite the fact that they were trying to tell us that he was. But I can put that down to the actor rather than the plot, I suppose.

Edit 2: Plus, the original movie at least acknowledged the absurdity of Luke being so good at things. There was the whole "we're really putting our trust in a farm boy?" thing, and "I'm good at this because..." whereas nobody really questions or doubts Rey at all. Finn willing to put Rey over the fate of the universe was just weird because he really hadn't known her long enough to be OTT obsessive about saving her.

I really don't know whether my problem is with Rey being overpowered, or if I just don't like how the movie dealt with it. Generally I like women who can do everything but there's something about how the whole thing with Rey was handled that really rubbed me the wrong way.
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Old 12-30-2015, 04:59 PM   #38
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It's fine if the handling of her storyline isn't your thing, but it doesn't necessarily make her a bad character. The film was written in such a way that you're meant to root for her coming into her powers. I bought into the film's writing and wanted to be on her side. The writing didn't do its job for you while it worked for others.

Finn and Poe aren't invalid because of her. Luke and Han could both fly - he was even the one to destroy the Death Star - but that didn't take away from Han and the Falcon. Characters' skills overlap, and Rey isn't the best at everything. Finn is going to be better with a gun, have the tactical knowledge, and know the enemy. Poe is the best pilot in the Resistance. Rey doesn't compare. She just has the Force on her side. And we didn't know if this was her first time at anything she did. There's a lot we don't know about her yet, because this is only the first film and we don't even have her entire background.

It's ultimately impossible to compare one movie of Rey to fully developed characters from a trilogy. We don't have all the information, and this is only the start of her story.







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Old 12-30-2015, 09:25 PM   #39
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Everyone hates anakin. Rey is getting slated compared to luke. Luke took a battering every movie. Rey didn't even have a hair out of place. There was no sense of danger.
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Old 12-30-2015, 09:32 PM   #40
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Quote:
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I like Kylo as a villain but if they go the route of Rey/Kylo I may lose all faith in this series. I seriously can't get behind hero/villain ships like that, especially after Kylo has just killed his own father/Rey's father figure? I'm not sure she'd ever be able to get around that either. Maybe he'll return to the light and people may come around to forgiving him (I think Leia will because she takes after her mother so much) but I don't think Rey would ever feel anything more for him. If anything I'm expecting her and Finn even though my heart wants Finn/Poe more than life itself.

Again, just my opinions/theories! I'm just happy we have new Star Wars tbh.
I couldn't stop thinking about this today. I honestly don't think they'll go that route, or if they do, they won't do it in a way that I approve of I don't see Rey ever forgiving Kylo if they give him a redemption arc, so I can't see them realistically developing a relationship. But what I can see and REALLY REALLY want to happen is for Kylo to manipulate her/tempt her to the dark side.

There is so much potential for Rey to go to the dark side. We've already seen that Kylo's master is interested in her powers, and there's a lot of untapped emotions that could be turned. Being abandoned by her parents and then her father figure in Han Solo was murdered? She could easily use that to channel rage and go dark. I dont think it'll ever happen but it'd be amazing and I'd love to see the Rey/Kylo interactions then

Either way I think we'd have Rey turning evil or Kylo turning good, both of which have already been done in the Star Wars universe so I'm curious how the new movies will make it original







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